Monday, November 14, 2011

On Conversing with Fence Posts....

Before I get back to Perfesser Simpson, go read the comment thread following On respect for flags, because this post is a continuation of that. Robert Baker, for those who are just coming to this, is a follower of Kevin Levin, an anti-Confederate, an indoctrinee who emerged from higher education hermetically sealed off from the outside world and new ideas -- at least, judging by my interaction with him on the Southern Heritage Preservation Group and his blog. He appears to have drunk deeply of the Politically Correct Civil War Kool Aid....

Robert's comments are in blue. Mine are in gray.

Robert: Your ardent defense represents your feelings about the flag.

Me: NO! Really? Ya think?

And if I could access the Facebook page again, I could provide you examples of.

Of what? People holding the Confederate flag "sacred"? Maybe. Probably just holding it in great respect. But look, what if there are people out there who fall down and worship it, and pray to it three times a day? WHAT'S IT TO YOU? Why is it any of your business? If you don't care about the flag or Confederate heritage, that's just fine with me, I ain't gonna tell you they should. But where do you authoritarians -- who are completely antithetical to American freedom, by the way -- get off telling others what they should and should not think?

I also use sacred as a loose term but if you want to divide it into religious gestures to make you feel better. Go ahead.

You used it as a "loose term"? What does that mean -- a term with no meaning? Sacred has a meaning, Robert. Look, did you mean to imply that Confederate heritage people put the flag on a plane with God, Jesus and religion, or not? Because I don't, and I don't see much of that on SHPG, either. I see a lot of respect for the flag and for the soldiers who carried it... But again, it's none of your business how other people see it.

1.) Your first point is trying to justify your defense based on the assertion that it is okay.

NO! Really? Ya think? Defense based on the assertion that something is okay? Who would have EVER thought of that! Am I breaking new ground here in human reasoning, or what?

Again, I've never said that nor has anyone. Yet you promote some of the very things seen above in the misuse of the Confederate flag under the guise of 'heritage'.

You've never said what? That Confederate heritage advocates are responsible for policing the treatment of the flag? Corey has certainly implied it on his blog, more than once.

2.) Why are you responsible? For your inaction.
Well, Robert, you find out who made the plastic Confederate flag truck testicles, let me know, and I'll go ask 'em to stop.

Your fervent defense of the flag i the face of opposition that are offended knows no bounds...

You're absolutely right because I think the vast majority of "offendedness" over the flag is phony, made up, without depth. It is not the result of somebody feeling offended, but of somebody wanting to tell others what the can and cannot do, what they can and cannot think. It is the result of authoritarianism trying to end free thought and force everyone's brain into the same mold -- a mental, cultural, historical Procrustean bed.

...yet your defense of the banana hammock stainless banner is non-existent.

There's a banana hammock stainless banner? The one I found on the Internet sure looks like the StarznStripes to me.

3.) He is not demonizing anyone. He is pointing out the hypocrisy of the defense you make (as I listed above) in contrast to the non-existent defense in cases such as that. Some of these examples have been pointed out in connection with that facebook group which I cannot see.

Pay attention, Robert. Corey is demonizing the Tampa SCV. He is implying that they did not put the big Confederate flag beside the Interstate as a symbol of Confederate heritage, but because of babes in Confederate flag bikinis (he sems to have a fixation on scantily clad babes, particularly if there's anything Confederate about their teeny, tiny apparel) and because of plastic truck testicles with Confederate flag on them. That is exactly what he implied.

Yes, there are proConfederate people who need to be educated in the proper display of the flag, but Corey's (and I daresay your) interest is not in educating them but in demonizing them.

If it is your business to tell Confederate heritage advocates that they must police, restrict, and stop the misuse of the flag (but then who would y'all have to demonize?), then it is my business to tell opponents how they must police, restrict and stop the misuse of the U.S. flag. Presumably, Corey considers himself to be a proud American, but I've never seen him defend Old Glory in situations like those I showcased on my blog.

The difference, Robert -- and do try to grasp this ... the difference is that I'm not holding him or you responsible for stopping the trashing of the Stars and Stripes. I don't have your gestapo mentality.

Also, don't use the war like it happened yesterday. You didn't fight in it. To pretend you have stake in it is to spit on everyone that did.

I haven't done that. What have you been smoking?

Finally, He did not set the standard. He commented on your lack of standard. You should know the difference.

Yes, he did. He's the one who started it, on his blog, implying that Confederate heritage advocate -- the SCV, the UDC, the Facebook group, whoever -- are responsible for anyone's misuse of the flag. Now, when the same standard is applied to him and the flag he presumably honors, both you and he are going through all kinds of nutty gyrations to pretend you don't know what I'm talking about.

Your last statement is sort of retarded. Sorry but it is. Union heritage advocates would include Southerners that fought in the Revolution, 1812, Mexican-American, Southern Unionists, Spanish American, World War I, World War II, Korea, Vietnam, Grenada, Persian Gulf, Boznia, Iraqi Freedom, Afghanistan and so on.

Sorry, that is not correct. "Union" in my usage clearly implies the North/feds in the War Between the States. Period. Besides, this country is not called "the Union" anymore. It is the United States.

So are you saying Southerners are responsible as well?

If they wanna be, why not?

Or maybe you should create the catch all that EVERYONE, including you with your ridiculous rants above, is responsible for the trashing of the flag. Got it now?

Sorry, no. I don't hold Confederate heritage advocates responsible for policing misuse of the Confederate flag (but I approve and applaud when they do) and I don't hold Union heritage advocates, or just run-of-the-mill Americans responsible for policing the misuse of the U.S. flag, but I would have no objection if anyone did. You authoritarians are the ones who assign responsibility to others based on YOUR beliefs (and misconceptions).

If you like I can put it in crayon using Grey with CBF stickers to make it pop

Nah, just try writing something that makes sense.


  1. I like how you didn't post the comments you made that I replied to. Kind of like your research on Black Confederates, you present things out of context.

  2. Did you miss the very first sentence? Quote, "...go read the comment thread following On respect for flags, because this post is a continuation of that..." There's yer context.

  3. In your style, it's "you're". Yer is not a word. To address your point, it is still out of context without the original verification and its original surrounding meaning. Plus you misspelled 'in.'

  4. My style, in this instance, is "yer." "You're" is a contraction for "you are" and I didn't mean, "There's you are context." Nope, it's not out of context when you instruct readers where to find the context. I doubt that I misspelled "in." I probably made a typo.

  5. I compromise on the Typo. And it is out of context without appropriation. However I would like to return to the issue on the other post.

  6. Actually disregard the last, you commented on it here in the above post.

    You say, "Sorry, that is not correct. "Union" in my usage clearly implies the North/feds in the War Between the States. Period. Besides, this country is not called "the Union" anymore. It is the United States."

    Union, in your usage clearly implies the United States. Ulysses S. Grant was not commander of the armies of the Union. He was commander of the armies of the United States. It was the United States Colored Troops not the Union Colored Troops. Words matter. "Yer" clear implication is an incorrect one as common terminology would match the words Union and United States as being synonymous with one another. Union heritage advocates, aka advocates of heritage of the United States might(key word in this sentence) be at fault. However, there is a Federal Court system in place and a mandated law that will prosecute others if they misuse the flag. Confederate Heritage advocates have no law in place nor do they actively attempt such measures. It does not fit the agenda of propaganda and distortion to do so....Meyer is merely pointing out that inaction.

  7. We just have more respect for people's First Amendment free-expression rights -- even when the expression is offensive -- than you apparently do.

  8. I'm sure that's what it is Connie. Since I am the one that was completely banned from y'all's little Facebook group I can completely agree with your passion about the United States's Constitution. I am also in agreement having never banned a comment from my cite short of asking something to edit their own and resubmit for cleanliness. But hey what do I know, apparently I don't have that respect for the United States's Constitution than you guys. It's funny though. The First Amendment to defend the flag is really the only time you guys actually use, adhere and worship the U.S.'s Constitution. Of course it does meet the needs and wants of your agenda though.

  9. Banning someone, or being banned, from a Facebook group does show disrespect to the Constitution or restrict anyone's freedom of expression. You can do it on your blog, or on the comment threads of your buddies' blogs, you can do it outside the Internet, on paper, with a Mr. Microphone...

    I haven't banned you from my comment threads here, have I? Or removed any of your posts? I believe I have deleted maybe two, three comments from my blogs, ever, that were put there by web crawler robots, not people.

    I'm on record at SHPG more than once, by the way, of favoring non-censorship. The only reason I would delete anything would be for profanity, obscenity, threats and such.

    Other than that,a kindly point out where I have advocated restriction of freedom of expression -- anywhere. My flag essay was to point out Corey Meyer's double standard, nothing more. The same laws that protect your freedom of expression protects that of Kluxers, Panthers, Westboro lunatics, people who trivialize and trash the Confederate flag and the US flag. Would you be willing to give up your freedom of expression under the first amendment so that flag trivializers could be stopped?

  10. Did I say you have banned me? I just find it hypocritical that you say you have this high moral standing when it comes to the 1st Amendment over us (meaning me, Simpson, Levin etc.) yet I didn't see you express your dissatisfaction of that banning. Sort of the same point Meyer made; your inaction tells the tale. He was pointing out your hypocrisy. You cry freedom of speech when someone removes the flag, saying it is a symbol of your heritage. Yet, the symbol of heritage seems to be gladly worn around someone's testicles. But hey, heritage is in the loins I guess.


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